Comments on: Grrrrrs, Shouts, and If I Were In Chargeof’s http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/ Carlos Whittaker's Weblog Fri, 10 Feb 2012 08:05:38 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.3 By: gbrad@mag http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129752 gbrad@mag Sat, 03 Nov 2007 23:20:02 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129752 Now thas bein' real. I know we get angry , but scripture says put it aside. If our leaders don't then the possibility exists that they may lead us astray. I KNOW they don't wanna do that. Critical post ,los. grace and peace Now thas bein’ real. I know we get angry , but scripture says put it aside. If our leaders don’t then the possibility exists that they may lead us astray. I KNOW they don’t wanna do that. Critical post ,los.
grace and peace

]]> By: mike foster http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129407 mike foster Sat, 03 Nov 2007 05:13:21 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129407 well said and couldnt agree more carlos...their is so much good to be done in the world...i think back to what andy crouch said that you change culture by creating culture...not by critiquing it... peace...mike. well said and couldnt agree more carlos…their is so much good to be done in the world…i think back to what andy crouch said that you change culture by creating culture…not by critiquing it…

peace…mike.

]]> By: Raj http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129270 Raj Fri, 02 Nov 2007 20:12:37 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129270 I completely agree that many who are frustrated with the Church often come off as smug, arrogant, and angry. This is true of both Christians and non-Christians who take issue with the Church. A careful balance must be struck, however, in our approach to these people. Many of them are passionate, spiritually convicted individuals whose frustration is borne out of loving Christ's Bride so deeply. Sure, they clearly struggle to work through these frustrations in a Godly and constructive way, but they also make really good points about how different modern American Christianity is from the ancient models of following Jesus. If we do not lovingly and gently correct and encourage these exasperated saints and instead merely talk about their error, then aren't we just complaining about the complainers? Living together in a community of faith is a beautiful and mysterious thing that only God Himself could have designed. It includes both those who have either maintained or (re)discovered a love for the Church as it is and those to whom God has given great insight about Her shortcomings. No matter on which side of the spectrum we find ourselves, God calls us to love Him first and to love each other (even the frustrated and/or frustrating). For that, there is no substitute. I completely agree that many who are frustrated with the Church often come off as smug, arrogant, and angry. This is true of both Christians and non-Christians who take issue with the Church.

A careful balance must be struck, however, in our approach to these people. Many of them are passionate, spiritually convicted individuals whose frustration is borne out of loving Christ’s Bride so deeply. Sure, they clearly struggle to work through these frustrations in a Godly and constructive way, but they also make really good points about how different modern American Christianity is from the ancient models of following Jesus.

If we do not lovingly and gently correct and encourage these exasperated saints and instead merely talk about their error, then aren’t we just complaining about the complainers?

Living together in a community of faith is a beautiful and mysterious thing that only God Himself could have designed. It includes both those who have either maintained or (re)discovered a love for the Church as it is and those to whom God has given great insight about Her shortcomings.

No matter on which side of the spectrum we find ourselves, God calls us to love Him first and to love each other (even the frustrated and/or frustrating). For that, there is no substitute.

]]> By: bobby http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129249 bobby Fri, 02 Nov 2007 18:58:53 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129249 I like what John mentioned earlier. I think it's a great point you make Los. Just complaining and being angry without movement or solutions is just destructive. But where is the balance? I think the question is what are we doing with our dissatisfaction? There are times that a little "complaint" is warranted and is a spark from an actual issue needing to be solved that can then ignite a fire inside of us to "start living." I wonder how many great revolutions have been started as a result of dissatisfaction with the status quo. The one that comes to mind the most is Martin Luther. What if he hadn't gotten angry and challenged the direction of his modern church? Given, we're nowhere near the state they were in then. Thus the need for balance. So I don't disagree AT ALL, just makes me think about the flip side as well. I like what John mentioned earlier. I think it’s a great point you make Los. Just complaining and being angry without movement or solutions is just destructive. But where is the balance? I think the question is what are we doing with our dissatisfaction?

There are times that a little “complaint” is warranted and is a spark from an actual issue needing to be solved that can then ignite a fire inside of us to “start living.”

I wonder how many great revolutions have been started as a result of dissatisfaction with the status quo. The one that comes to mind the most is Martin Luther. What if he hadn’t gotten angry and challenged the direction of his modern church?

Given, we’re nowhere near the state they were in then. Thus the need for balance. So I don’t disagree AT ALL, just makes me think about the flip side as well.

]]> By: Dan http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129241 Dan Fri, 02 Nov 2007 18:35:53 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129241 Great post. <i>Just seems to me that there is a movement being built on frustration.</i> Amen and bring it. Look, we're all rebels by nature, and it isn't just rebellion against God that's sinful. It's definitely healthy (and necessary, I think) for the church to question our own traditions and try to peer past our cultural assumptions, but when we start rebelling against tradition for rebellion's sake, we're completely missing what Christ has called us to be and do. Great post.

Just seems to me that there is a movement being built on frustration.

Amen and bring it. Look, we’re all rebels by nature, and it isn’t just rebellion against God that’s sinful. It’s definitely healthy (and necessary, I think) for the church to question our own traditions and try to peer past our cultural assumptions, but when we start rebelling against tradition for rebellion’s sake, we’re completely missing what Christ has called us to be and do.

]]> By: Zack http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129225 Zack Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:55:48 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129225 Read those guys (especially Mr. Mclaren) with serious discretion. They have some great ideas, and they definitely have some things to say that the Church in America needs to hear, but they're a great example of why creativity needs to be carefully connected to orthodoxy. I won't turn this very stress-free blog into an emerging/emergent argument, but just use discretion. Read those guys (especially Mr. Mclaren) with serious discretion. They have some great ideas, and they definitely have some things to say that the Church in America needs to hear, but they’re a great example of why creativity needs to be carefully connected to orthodoxy.
I won’t turn this very stress-free blog into an emerging/emergent argument, but just use discretion.

]]> By: Los http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129204 Los Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:17:10 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129204 I read that book a few years back. Great read. I read that book a few years back. Great read.

]]> By: Vince http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129202 Vince Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:15:17 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129202 Did you read '<a href="http://www.amazon.com/Adventures-Missing-Point-Culture-Controlled-Neutered/dp/0310267137/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-9258668-1361600?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1194019903&sr=8-1" rel="nofollow">Adventures in Missing The Point'</a> by Tony Campolo and Brian Mclaren. Touches on how we compromise the gospel and allow American Moral Traditions to become gospel truth. Did you read ‘Adventures in Missing The Point’ by Tony Campolo and Brian Mclaren. Touches on how we compromise the gospel and allow American Moral Traditions to become gospel truth.

]]> By: Los http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129199 Los Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:14:33 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129199 Any ideas on...? I'm full of them. But most of the time they are bad ones. So I just try and love my kids, love my wife, and love my God everyday. Any ideas on…?
I’m full of them. But most of the time they are bad ones. So I just try and love my kids, love my wife, and love my God everyday.

]]> By: Zack http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/2007/11/grrrrrs-shouts-and-if-i-were-in-chargeofs/#comment-129197 Zack Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:11:06 +0000 http://www.ragamuffinsoul.com/?p=3220#comment-129197 Big amen brother. Got any ideas? Big amen brother.

Got any ideas?

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