Quit Giving The Devil My Music // My thoughts on Christians and our virgin ears
Listen.
Here is what I believe.
I believe that God created art.
I believe that God created all people who craft His art.
Jay-Z might not know that the beats and cadence he got came from something greater than him.
Spielberg may not know that the gift of directing a movie came from someone much greater than he.
Oprah may not know where she got her woo.
Some people are just confused as to where they got their gifting.
Some people cover the gift of God’s art with nastiness.
Some people cover His art with the beauty it deserves.
All the while, it all starts with Him.
When people tell me that I shouldn’t listen to music because it is the devil’s music, I tell them to stop giving the devil credit for the sick beat.
The devil may own the person who wrote it, and may be littered all over the lyrics, but the music, the music is Gods.
The rhythms, harmonies, melodies, and cadence, are all a gift from God Himself.
I can appreciate a Jay-Z or Kanye joint without believing that I should call my wife a bitch.
I can enjoy an episode of Lost without selling my soul to the devil because John Locke doesn’t believe in Jesus.
I can watch Angelina Jolie shoot a gun in a tank top without wanting to run to the bathroom.
l can appreciate all the art that God has gifted His creation with for what the art is.
This does not mean that I have to agree with lyric.
It just means I can appreciate the cadence of the lyric.
So instead of trying to convince me to stop listening to Jay-Z and Kanye I’m going to ask you to do 3 things.
1. Make songs that are as good as Jay-Z and Kanye’s so I can listen to the heavenly lyrics you place on God’s beats. And my boy Lecrae can do it all alone.
2. Stop giving the devil credit for all the good art out there.
3. Relax. 
Let’s hear ye ragamuffins…
Los
RAIN IT DOWN
preach.
3 more weeks!!!
I was hoping you’d write this post.
Thanks, Los!
Thanks Michelle for your patience…
I’ve been hammered quite a bit for this because of my love of the band Rush. I’ve had many non-Christian friends question my faith in Christ because I listen to “an atheist band.” I just smile and say that God would take ‘em just like everyone else.
yup…
love this. and completely agree.
i used to be one of ‘those people.’ you know the one who would call others out and let everyone else know i did so. but inside i was wrestling with my own fears, doubts, struggles, temptations. and i knew i was a hypocrite. but it gave me pleasure pointing the finger at someone else, because it kept the focus off me. or so i thought.
then there’s the Holy Spirit. and i was convicted. and i changed.
if people have an issue with something, then that means God is convicting them to not listen, not watch or or steer clear of something because the temptation is too great.
for instance, my wife and i choose to not watch movies with a lot of unnecessary f-words. my former self would have preached this on everyone. but my changed-by-Christ self realizes that is my personal conviction. and i am not being obedient if i ignore my convictions. and i am also not being obedient if i force my convictions on others.
Josh Brown. Can you please teach the world your ways…
yesyesyes. amen!
AMEN!!!
^ truth.
If a truth is communicated by an ungodly person, it doesn’t make it untrue.
Truth is truth. Beauty is Beauty. Good is good. Doesn’t matter who’s mouth it falls out of.
#truth
I liked that song when we were brushing something off our shoulders…????
If yo feelin like a pimp nigga go on dust them shouldas off!!!
ladies is pimps to go on brush them shoulders off….
i’m a baby… listened to that song at middle school dances. I was in the middle of the dance circles dustin mine off!
“I can watch a Angelina Jolie shoot a gun in a tank top without wanting to run to the bathroom.”
I about lost it on that one. Good job.
I’ve typed about 15 responses but we’re going with this one.
Thank you for being open, honest, and real. Thanks for seeing life through God’s eyes and sharing that with the rest of us. Thanks for keeping us focused on our Father and not all the other junk around us.
You are welcome…
word
to
…yo mothas and bruthas
… and to the hatas and lovas…
Thank you for articulating this so well.
I think we all are personally convicted when a song goes too far. I know where this threshold is for me, and it’s probably different for everyone else.
We do have to be careful not to pollute our minds with sinful thoughts that come from exposure to media. There’s no question that suggestive lyrics can trigger lust in a guy’s heart and cause him to stumble. But the level at which that happens is between the person and God.
Teach Drew. This is good. I turn an eminemn song off all the time when he starts getting down right nasty. It just doesn’t feel right, for me.
Nicely put! A simple appreciation for the sake of art is not an endorsement of the statements made through lyrics. And we should remember at one time singing the major 3rd was considered sinful – and God forbid you use a tritone!
I’m reminded of one of my favorite quotes:
Music is God’s gift to man, the only art of Heaven given to earth, the only art of earth we take to Heaven – Landor
Wow. That quote is amaaaazing
i had a kid and his mom ask me advice for how he could be a good bass player.
i told him to listen to The Ramones.
She told me not to tell her son to listen to worldly music.
i tried, kid.
I’d tell him to listen to you
Show me a musician in ANY genre who was *not* influenced by that “worldly” music when they were starting their craft! If they weren’t then I can almost guarantee they’re playing root notes on bass, everything with a capo in G on guitar and everything transposed to G or C on keys…
I couldn’t agree with you more! I am so sick of hearing people call certain music or movies or even books as of the devil. The devil isn’t a creative being, he is a created being. People just need to chillax!
Jason… like
So are we not creative beings either? Are we just God-beat discoverers?
I’m honestly asking… since we’re created too.
Well, we are created in the image of God. And he is a creator. So I believe that the drive we have to create is a reflection of God’s character. Some people misuse their ability to create, but it’s still a gift from God.
You and your heathen ways.
I’m just a heathen
I hear you. But I also share some concern that people may have. This is perfect post because I decided to revisit ‘The Chronic’ over the last week or so.
It’s brilliant effort. Dre revolutionized west coast hip hop with that CD and of course, it introduced the world to Snoop Dogg. The beats, the infusion of instruments and the laid back style (as opposed to the in your face style of NWA) all contributed to its greatness.
At the same time however, it’s a work that is rife with misogyny.
I think there are ways to address such issues without the judgment and I always believe it comes back to do what the spirit is leading you to do and not concern yourself with others.
I listen to ‘The Chronic’ and don’t get concerned. However, I stopped watching ‘Boardwalk Empire’ because while it is a well written, well acted show, the sex and nudity was far too gratuitous in my view. But that’s just me. If others want to watch, enjoy.
It also about priorities. Ok, so you’re not listening to Jay-Z and Kanye, but you’re listening to KJ-52. You’re not watching ‘Pulp Fiction’ but you’re watching ‘The Sound of Music.’ You’re not tuning in to see ‘The Walking Dead’ but you have the DVR set every week for ‘Once Upon A Time.’
Great. But how is your prayer life? How often are pushing aside that Bible in order to watch that re-run of ‘Little House On The Prairie’? You do a great job of keeping your teenage kids from playing violent video games, but how much time are you spending with them?
My thoughts summed up: Matthew 7:3
This is amazing.
I love all of it.
Like I said in a comment earlier, I can pretty much listen to anything, then I listen to some on eminem’s songs and HAVE to change it. I just can’t handle some of it.
But I’m such a jaded calloused pastor, I’m almost immune. Pray for my refreshing!!!
A-to the-MEN! God doesn’t want us to form a religious Christian bubble that rejects everything as unholy if it doesn’t have a Dove label on it.
Sinners are not the enemy of God. The darkness that shrowds them is. A person that has a disdain for Jay-Z and others will never fall on their knees for them or any other lost soul.
Dude.
The Mars Volta, St. Vincent, and Bon Iver make me love Jesus more. Seriously.
Everything in this comment is truth.
I love it bro!! Exactly what needed to be said!!
this is why I come to this site. As a worship leader who plays quite a bit of contemporary christian music, but listens to none outside of work, its difficult to explain to people who listen to nothing but jesus radio.
the world is full of amazing music, just because it doesn’t explicitly call on gods name doesn’t make it any less gods music. we played pearl jam’s ‘just breathe’ for worship a couple weeks ago.
to quote martin luther “Beautiful music is the art of the prophets that can calm the agitations of the soul; it is one of the most magnificent and delightful presents God has given us.”
thanks los, play on!
what? the devil doesn’t live in my radio??? the “rocky” amy grant and MWS albums of my youth aren’t evil????
oh the ways we like to twist things to suit our fancy…learning personal limits and accountability are much more difficult than just saying “NO!” or “THAT’s NOT ALLOWED!”
Just because the work has the name Jesus in it, and by the end, everyone is saved, doesn’t make it good. Whether its Christian music, books, movies, etc. I don’t like “Christian” music. I like GOOD music. Which usually doesn’t come in the Christian genre for me…
So when I was 11 telling my mom that I listen to Snoop’s “Doggystyle” & Dre’s “The Chronic” cuz of the beats and not the lyrics… I was right?!? You mean I really did just appreciate all of Silk’s sweet harmonies in “Freak Me”?!?
I TOLD YOU SO MOM! I told you.
Booyah!
Reply…
Hahaha! Thanks for that
That’s funny. For me it was Appetite for Destruction.
Good word. I personally have to be careful of the lyrics I allow into my heart through my ears and mind b/c I am very impressionable. Yes, I totally agree with the 3 things you asked everyone to do. We DO need more Godly alternatives. I am becoming convinced of this more and more. And yes, Lecrae can bring it pretty well. So can PRo, Brothatone and Canon. Peace!
It seems you have quite a clamoring of people who were waiting for you to write this post for a long time (i.e. every single other comment seems to be in agreement or close enough).
I don’t agree, but don’t feel like I can articulate it in a way that would be well received. That’s unfortunate, as it makes me mostly just want to unsubscribe from your RSS feed. (why is that unfortunate? Because if all the iron agrees with itself, it doesn’t ever get sharpened).
Sorry to be a negative nancy. Just not feelin’ it.
Wait. So you want to unsubscribe because you don’t agree? That sucks. Dont quit before you have even tried to run the race.
What up Los I’m new to this. Someone posted on Face Book and I read. Now I don’t agree with you on some of this blog.
First off its really hard to just listen to a beat. This seems to be the first thing a person tends to say when listening to something that he or she should not listen too. Christian or not that was my excuse before getting saved and for a time after. If it were just a beat you would not know the hooks and punch lines to songs. That’s what proved to me it was more than just a beat.
Second it really depends on you and where you are spiritually. If you can not handle it you should stay away from it. A person on a strict diet would not go put them selfs in a all u can eat buffet of grease and fat.
Music is awesome I will not deny that. But some of the music that is being played is pure garbage. From Jay and West to Katy Perry, niki minaj and the list goes on.
Your thoughts infect your mind. Your mind effects your heart. Your heart speaks out your mouth. Your words effect your atmosphere. When it comes down to it. You are what you eat.
Lyrics are living words. It’s more than just a beat.
Lastly there is plenty of us making music that is on the Jay and west level. It’s just mostly still underground. Crea and 116 is just a part of Holy Hip Hop not the only Holy hip hop.
Look forward to checking out future posts from you.
Check out some of the other Holy Hip Hop
http://Www.facebook.com/xtralargeatx
Twitter.com/xtralarge
Don’t sweat it too much Eric. I disagree with a whole bunch of stuff I read on this blog. And, like you, don’t have a real easy time trying to figure out how to say it in a way that makes sense.
But I gotta tell ya. It all makes me think about what I DO believe and why I have those beliefs.
I don’t hold the author up to be perfect. Just a great guy who is headed to the same place I am (Heaven), and is doing his best to bring a WHOLE lotta folks with him. He’s no more perfect than I am. So, until I get a different word from a burning bush itself, I will continue to read on and be challenged… I hope you do too.
Eric, if you don’t agree … then express it man! I think you’re robbing the opportunity for someone’s iron to be sharpened if you’re keeping yours to yourself.
I could be wrong, but I don’t think Carlos built this blog to get his ego stroked. You should read his Twitter feed, haha … continual criticism, and I’ve yet to see him take it in an inappropriate manner. I agree with you Eric, Romans 14 tells us to “strive for things that bring peace and build each other up”; however, I think Carlos is trying to cultivate some community here … in the right setting I think it’s okay to humbly let some things loose.
With that said, I’m not 100% comfortable with Carlos’ take on music … or a lot of things for that matter, lol. But that’s just it, what isn’t based on faith is sin. What Carlos is comfortable with, doesn’t mean I have to be or even should be. Simply because something is permissible doesn’t mean it’s beneficial; that’s between you and God. Hopefully we take up our “freedoms” in prayer and continually check ourselves. This is one reason to have Godly individuals in your life who you can be accountable to.
Granted I listen to secular music; I do think God can transcend an artist’s intent in a song. How many churches sang “I Believe I Can Fly” right?
But for me if a song’s lyrics have an ill message, I have to turn it off … it changes my mood … for me it’s not beneficial. I always make sure that my “worship” time outweighs my “secular” time.
Just my two cents … for what it’s worth.
Blessings.
Hey Eric, I’ve been a lurker for a while. I feel like if I said what I really think there could be issues. So I understand the hesitation.
I’m an artist, and my passion is acting. Sunday night I spent over three hours in a group conversation about the intersection of faith and art/theatre. The play that I’ve been most moved by was not a Christian production. It’s a big frustration of mine that so much of the best art isn’t being produced by Christians. Some of that is probably because Christian culture can tend to have a pretty narrow view of what is acceptable as art, or they want to add to it and explain it instead of letting it speak for itself. I get encouraged whenever I find other Christians who are on the journey to produce art that means something but is also good art. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Carlos.
I particularly liked the first point about making beats as good as Jay-Z. I think this is a particular problem within Christian music. They’re simply satisfied with creating mediocre, uncreative music. Personally, I listen to more secular music than Christian music, simply because there are very few creative, good Christian bands (But praise the Lord that there are some
. Should we settle for something that we think is subpar or look for things to inspire us? Thomas Kinkade isn’t the only painter in the world and Mercy Me isn’t the only band in the world (no offense to those people who like them).
Friedrich Nietzsche once said something that really got to me and I think is a good quote to end this response with:
“They would have to sing better songs for me to learn to have faith in their Redeemer; and his disciples would have to look more redeemed!”
My sister and I had this discussion a while ago. I, just don’t see much good “Christian” music out there. I listened to Christian music exclusively for a long time in my youth and finally just tired of the lack of lyrical innovation. In the end I held on to a few bands (Crashdog, 77′s, few others) and got rid of the rest. I just got tired of hearing about how great God is. No doubt he’s great now let’s discuss something else. Tell me what you think about politics, love, literature. In the end I suspect the label “Christian” is simply used to sell more albums. That pretty much makes the “Christian” music biz as bad as the secular.
Amen! However, I do so wish the Black Eyed Peas didn’t use the N word and Foster the People didn’t drop the f-bomb so much. Mainly because my 2 & 4 yr old love to get their grooves on to that music.
amen amen. well said.
Agree.
truthfully – DMX has spoken more biblical truth to me than about 90% of churchy pastors I have listened to.
Who are we to question his relationship with Jesus only because he chooses to be realer than most any of us and share the reality of his life?
Who am I to question lyrics of Eminem when he says:
“I appreciate the prayer, but I’ve already got
God on my side…”
He very well may be in a relationship with God. And maybe his sin is in his tongue?
So much of what we do and stand for as “christians” is simply about how we look to those around us. The bible spends a good chunk of pages warning against that and yet we still do it.
And then we openly proclaim that “God knows our hearts.” We just don’t act like it.
So bust out “Puke” by Eminem and I’ll sing along with ya or bark like DMX and I will too. Matter of fact, start singing some Carlos Whittaker and after I download some I am sure I’ll sing along with that too – I just like music.
A few thoughts..
Oh, this takes me back to our BBC youth group days… had a leader pick up my U2 cassette and “preach” at me about the lyrics being so UNchristian.
Regarding rap music, I do love enjoying those sic beats, but it does bother me when it gets so foul…probably more so now that our 15 year old son is listening to much of it. But as his parents we just continue to pick our battles, practice grace and shower him with love.
… and I just can’t disagree with my son when he says that
Lil’ Wayne is a lyrical genius!
I’m the biggest Jay-Z fan in all of Christendom, but I don’t know how to support him when he throws lyrics like “Jesus can’t save you life starts when the church ends.” As much as I love his skills and the obviously God given talent from common grace, me listening to those lyrics and celebrating and supporting Jay-Z can’t please Jesus. Right?
What’s your favorite TV show?
Well played Los! 7th Heaven is off the air so unless Matt is watching some serious DVD re-runs… YOU. GOT. HIM.
Tymm,
“YOU. GOT. HIM”
For real?
Is that an attitude that invites people to share a different opinion? Or Should just the yes men chime in?
Not sure if that’s how you meant it, but that felt a little 3rd grade.
On another note: What Matt watches is quite irrelevant. This post is about music. Maybe Matt has something to bring to the table, and maybe he doesn’t. But if he does we would be wise to listen and not just dismiss him if he watches rated R movies.
Does that make sense?
Sports Night, or currently it’s Community. I’m not sure what you mean. I’m not saying all music has to point people to Jesus. I love Plenty of music and television and movies that don’t. But those lyrics directly pull people away from Jesus. I don’t even have a problem with his whole JHova persona. But do we just give him a free pass because he’s talented? I’m not judging. This is seriously something I’m struggling through now.
“But do we just give him a free pass because he’s talented?”
Why does he need a free pass from “us” (whoever that is)?
Because the Bible is clear that as Christians, we are supposed to love what Jesus loves and hate what Jesus hates. And there is no way Jesus has anything but hatred for lyrics that tell people that Jesus can’t save them. My argument is that just because someone has God-given talent doesn’t mean that we should buy into what they are selling or support what they are doing. I know it’s a leap, but God made plenty of people incredibly beautiful andonstradof glorifying Him with their beauty, they make porn. We don’t support porn just because the beauty of a person comes from God. So just because God gave Jay his skills doesn’t mean we have to support him for the lyric that I pointed out. Again…I’m not judging or making a conclusion. I’m wrestling with this and trying to see other opinions.
What does Jesus love? Does Jesus love only songs about him? Does Jesus fail to see the beauty of a well told story? Would Jesus listen to “Jolene”? Is the Venus de Milo porn? Justice Stewart famously said, “I know it when I see it.”
I’m not saying there aren’t universal limits. The porn industry is a horrible industry that chews up people and spits them out when it’s done. Is the pop music industry different?
There are personal limits that we all have to find. I can watch Salma Hayeck and appreciate her beauty just the same way as I can watch L.L. Cool J and respect the amount of time he spends in the gym. I haven’t objectified either of them or committed a sin.
When I hear someone say that Jesus can’t save them I don’t hate them I laugh at them. That’s my new way to deal with people saying foolish things.
Can you help me understand what things “Jesus hates” – and, by extension, I’m now supposed to hate as well per your post above?
Also – can you help me reconcile the list of things Christians are supposed to hate with what Christ called the Greatest Commandment (love God, love your neighbor)? What if my neighbor does something on the Hate List? Do I keep loving him, or do I have to hate him now?
@ Tony –
Most think that Jesus cannot hate because God is love. But do you love babies? I think you do, therefore you must hate abortion. Do you love jews? I think you do, based on your example of loving your neighbor, therefore you must hate the holocaust. He hates sin, and Psalm 5, 11, Prov 6, Hos 9 all speak of God’s hatred of iniquity in the heart of man. We can’t just take our ideas of how we’d like God to be and dump them on the bible. We must let it shape our understanding and awe of our creator, of His mercy towards us who do not deserve it. When seen rightly, God is all the more magnificent in sight of His great holiness and His grace, superimposed against our unrighteousness and lack of reverence.
I agree. I recently (within the last month) decided to start attending Church again and for the longest time was led to believe that I couldn’t be ME and be a Christian at the same time.
Then I started finding blogs and books and twitter accounts of these modern Christians and realized that it’s ok to poke fun, and listen to (non Christian) music and be able to watch primetime TV and still be a awesome Christian at the same time.
Thank You!!
I 100% AGREE! This is the exact same reason I look at porn…because I appreciate the creativity behind the photography as well as the art of the female body.
Wait, that’s not right. HAHAH!
Look, I understand what you’re saying and I’m in no place to pass judgment. (I own every JayZ album to date) I just think that art can get to a place where it is abused, and it would be tough to justify supporting/condoning it at that point.
Personally, I don’t care what music you listen to, because I’m not you. But I CAN read your post and judge myself. Why do I listen to the music I do? What subconscious affects does it have on me? How would I feel if these lyrics were about my daughter? Why do I turn the volume up when I’m by myself, but turn the volume down when my son’s in the car? When did my convictions get calloused?
So thanks for the post bro. Because of it, I’m going to fast *some* hip-hop for a while and see how I feel when (if) I come back to it.
One other thing: I don’t think people are ‘going gorillas’ about the fact that you listen to (je)HOVA, but more so the fact that you quote his lyrics so frequently. It’s one thing to condone the music and another thing to condone the message…
All good thoughts.
But what lyrics have I quoted that condone a bad message?
Yup.
I don’t listen to some eminem songs because I can’t handle lyrics like “pu$$y juice” entering my dome.
It’s just gross.
And I think you turn it down in front of your kids for the same reason you don’t give them beer.
It’s not for them yet.
But it will be.
Ummmm… “H*A*M” for starters.
(look – I’ve done it too, not judging… just giving my opinion about why you’re hammered so hard about it)
The volume question was more about – why do I notice the lyrics when my 2 year old is listening, but don’t notice them when it’s just me…In other words: why do my convictions change around certain people? Is my calloused heart a good thing? And would Christ jam out to the song ‘Lucifer’ if he was with me – because of his appreciation of the art. (and the sick beat)
Just a bunch of questions I’m asking myself. Which is why I think taking a step back (a break from it) would help me discern that better. (personally)
Yea. But nobody got offended by that one. lol
They must not know what it means…cause it’s offensive as shhhhhhh!
Amen!! I have tried to explain this to people before, specifically my senior English teacher in high school, way back when. your words describe it perfectly! I listen to rock music, most of it litered with foul language, it doesn’t mean I can only speak that way or that I want to get high or party all the time. Just like talented musicians. Thanks!
Here is some guys to fill your itunes with that are better than Jay and Kanye (and maybe even better than Lecrae).
KB
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIdoZfd5_4A
Andy Mineo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npu2HKPMqSE
LOS (You guys have something in common! HAHA)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgqgyMoJFeI
HGA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZqMRHOVgPc
Thi’sl
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0bZk2CkPHY
That is just to name a few!
LOVE this.
Also in this area: Velvet Elvis. Rob Bell. Read it.
Thank you for this post! I feel closer to God anytime DCB is playing!!
ALSO, I have a deep respect for the beats, some lyrics and the cadence of Lil Wayne, yes he may be “misunderstood” but I feel his God given talent!!
Thank you again for creating a conversation worth having!
Hey bro, interesting thoughts and I agree with some of it, but here’s my perspective:
Unfortunately, music (and images) can have the ability to bypass our “thought filter” and go directly into our spirit man. For example, I can be in a store and hear a song, not really even pay attention to it, then I start singing the lyrics to that song later in the day, then I’m like, “Why am I singing that song I shouldn’t be singing?” Often times, just like watching a sexy scene in a movie, those lyrics can conjure up impure thoughts and imaginations that I would have never had, had I just watched something else or turned the crap off. Maybe since I’m an IT guy I have a GIGO (Garbage In Garbage Out) perspective. You must be a lot stronger than the average “weak” human. That kind of stuff effects me. I think it affects the majority of us if we are honest. I don’t want to be watching or listening to things that I’d be red-faced and ashamed of if Jesus physically came back today. But guess what, He is already here and He knows our thoughts and our heart. I just don’t think most of the garbage out there would make Jesus smile. And that’s ultimately my heart. Just a different perspective.
Bless you man
The Bible is where I go when I’m wrestling with this. Your insights are thought provoking; thank you. Gods true word. Rom 12:2, 1 Cor 10:31, psalm 101: 3-4. Point me to His words.
One last thought; surely there is a difference between worldly things and art like van goghe, spielberg, Bon iver and Then others like Kanye, a Creepy horror film (saw iiixv), . Can’t anyones God given talents and gifts be used by the enemy to kill, seek and destroy? And if that’s the case; can’t we recognize the talent but at the same time not support it, in fact – shouldnt we rebuke it. Imagine if to the Glory of God the art and creativity you appreciate and love so much was being used for His kingdom.
Sorry to be that guy. I’ve lived a sinners life and rolled in the darkest spots; so I’m no bubble boy here. Still love and listen to all my ‘secular’ albums; but trying to find His glory more and more in my own words and by what I watch and listen to. I need to have things (people, music, activities) around me pointing me to Him; otherwise I end up in old habits and behavior. Audi5000, jw
Romans 14:19-23 says it all.
19 Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. 20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. 21 It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother or sister to fall.
22 So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves. 23 But whoever has doubts is condemned if they eat, because their eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.
Well said. Nietzsche said “I would have believed in your God had you sung better songs about him.” A great challenge for creatives in the Church!
True story, fo sho! There are a TON of Christian artists/groups out there that are pure bubblegum pop BS; they’re making the music because it’ll sell to the holy trollers (aka: the ones that bitch and moan when a song even so much as suggests that life with Christ is anything but rainbows and freakin glitter).
I’ve grown up in the Church my entire life. I’m a HUGE lover of music. My biggest issue has always been that it’s VERY RARE that anyone makes stuff that’s actually worth listening to. THAT’s why so many people listen to secular (self included).
Not gonna lie… one of my biggest complaints is that there have been few (far between) really solid Christian rappers out there. Thanks to Lecrae and Tedashii for fixing that.
Peace and love, y’all.
Don’tf forget Da’ Truth, Trip Lee etc.
Los – when I played your latest single backwards; it said “Nathan Brown is my hero” over and over again.
If we being we are created in the image of God, and that redemption is an ongoing process that Jesus is doing in the world, that we have believe there are glimpses of the gospel in everything.
ransomfellowship.org/ is the place i go when i need some clarity on this. Denis and Margie to a great job of helping me understand how Jesus is continuing to redeem the world.
I’m no theologian, but I believe there is an “anointing” on many people who are not Christians…because I FEEL it in their music or their art.
I feel it when Harry Connick Jr. plays piano.
I feel it when Alice Munro writes.
I feel it when Rod Stewart sings “I Don’t Wanna Talk About It” with Amy Belle.
I REALLY feel it when kd lang sings Cohen’s “Hallelujah.”
I feel it in SO much secular music…and I believe it is there because the artist is doing what they were created by God to do, and that the majesty and wonder of that gifting pours through them, whether they ask for it or not, whether they know where it comes from or not.
oh, and hearing kd lang sing it live, outside, perched on a hill at night with thousands of people holding candles. so incredibly soul filling…I still thank God for that night. sorry…rabbit trail!
Oh. My. Gosh. I would have DIED.
She makes me cry when I hear her sing that. She’s got the voice of an angel, for sure.
Also, Andy Crouch’s book “Culture Making” is a strong call to Christians to make culture. Challenged me to get off my tush and do something better with art.
Amen!
Word.
What I hear in a lot of music is that the world is screaming for love and a savior. Keeps me relevant.
Some of my most profound God moments have been when I’m listening to praise music that is designed specifically to bring me to a place of worship. I love those times.
And some of my most profound God moments have been when I’m listening to something that has nothing to do with God at all. I love those times.
And some of my most profound God moments have been when I’ve been listening to music that is decidedly anti-God. I love those times.
God shows up when I look for him. It doesn’t have anything to do with the artist’s intentions.
“God shows up when I look for him.” Such an interesting thought. I do think you might be right Alise.
Wow. Another provocative Post. I like that. But…
Where do you think is the limit? Is there a limit?
You said “Some people cover the gift of God’s art with nastiness”. How much dirt or nastiness is okay to hear or watch? I really enjoy Metal and there are a ton of great guitarists that play Black Metal, but many of the lyrics are packed with blasphemy, murder, hate, sexual abuse and other dirt. Is it possible to enjoy the great riffs while really nasty things about Jesus are screamed in your ear?
You also wrote about movies. Where is the limit? When I watch our (german) Music Television I would call many of the clips Music-Soft-Porn. It’s not at all about telling a story its just about showing a body, but I must admit often with a lot of creativity and good filming, so you can call it art.
Where do you draw the lines?
Im looking forward to be challenged by your future posts…
I had this discussion with my young adults group earlier this week. I totally agree with you, but some of the people in my group wanted to know my scriptural basis for my view. I didn’t have one. Does anyone have anything I could reference?
Los, supporters, anyone??
I too would appreciate a scriptural argument.
I wish my youth pastors had the courage to say this when I was a teenager, would have meant a lot more enjoyment in Christ, rather than feeling guilty cause I liked Metallica and Dr. Dre.
This is something I can agree with. I agree with you in that the church needs to lighten up on some things. My church has an amazing creative department and uses a good amount of non christian media. But, I cannot agree that all you have to do is ignore the content and enjoy the beat. A lot of music is just packed with filth. Speaking from a strictly logical perspective, you can only remain uninfluenced by what you hear and see for so long. There has to be a line. None of us would watch porn and ignore the sex and enjoy the lighting and music. It’s extreme I know, but I’m just trying to illustrate there has to be a limit.
This is my 1st time reading your blog. I think I’ll be revisiting. Excellent post.
Have to say I agree. I can see both sides, but at the end of the day, as an artist and a creative arts director, I’ve been fed up with Christian music and the lack of true creativity and originality for too long. I started to write a response earlier, then realized it was turning into a blog post of its own. Here it is: http://bit.ly/ufat6N
Any, love your stuff. Keep it up.
If I may, let’s prioritize here – After consideration of lyrical content and beats and all other musical elements you still prefer to listen to Jay-Z and Kanye: You still put your preferences before pleasing God. Choosing to wallow in the sinful musings of others, no matter how creative the form, no matter how appealing the beat behind it is not noble, nor applause-worthy. You flirt with and run towards the very thing that Christ died to set us free from: sin? Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. This will be twisted: saying we shouldn’t listen to anything but the Gaithers and Maranatha. That’s just not the case – listen to your music but be discerning. Blessed are the pure in heart for they shall see God. We are offered a choice here.
Am I off here? Let’s bring in the truth. I welcome any comments.
Agree Shawn. 100 percent.
New favorite post. May I print it out & hand it around?
I get where you’re coming from man, but this post just swung the door wide open. Not all “non-christian” music is bad, but you just gave all of these people an excuse to hide behind. Maybe you are mature enough in your relationship with God to do certain things, or maybe you’ve just become complacent in that area. But you are a leader, and we aren’t supposed to be stumbling blocks. Music/Entertainment as a whole is a big issue for people, and those not strong enough to stand in their conviction just read this and think they can just watch/listen to whatever as long as they are “comfortable” with it.
We are supposed to guard our hearts. Yea, God gave them their abilities and talents, but they have twisted it and turned them for their own use. You saying these beats are from God is the same as saying pornography is from God. Porn is an art form right? The director and people involved all have God given talents so it’s from God. That sounds ridiculous. Why do you want to fill your head and heart with lyrics full of profane things? It just doesn’t make any sense. You’ve opened a can of worms on this one man, and I feel bad for the people struggling who aren’t strong enough to stand on their own that lean on this and a pass to do whatever as long as they aren’t convicted.
My heart’s broken right now after reading this. We need to be extremely careful what we allow ourselves to take in. Constantly alert. Your post, and the majority of replies, come across as self-justification.
Like I said, not all secular music/entertainment is bad, but we are called to a higher standard. This is not a higher standard. This is not the straight and narrow. This is not separating yourself to God. This is feel-good talk, that someone needs to make a stand on. We all have flaws, we all have things that we need to work on, but I just don’t see how Jesus, who died so that we may live, would want us to base our actions on our “conviction level”. or what we are “comfortable” with. We aren’t here to be comfortable. We are here to let people know about our awesome God and our saviour Jesus Christ, and show them that there is an alternative/better way. I’m not passing judgment man. Like I said my main concern is for the people who fall back on this as a free pass, who stumbled in their struggle because of this post. God bless man.
Reading Jay-Z’s book Decoded was an eye-opener for me. The man is an artist through and through. His life has been messy and hard, so of course his art is going to be messy and hard. True artists have to be true to themselves. It doesn’t mean you have to listen to it, but I don’t think we need to tame his message.
I love the sounds of music, but I’m also a lyric girl. You have to wade through sex and violence and money in his songs (which he says is what people want in his genre of music), but come to find out there is rich stuff buried in there, for those, as Alise said, who are looking for it.
In the past year I have found SO MUCH God in unexpected places, and it has breathed life into my faith. When you’re in the dark places of your faith, you’ll take God anywhere you can find Him. I’m no longer picky.
This is tough because it is such difficult topic for many. I think it can give people freedom who have struggled in ultra-conservative backgrounds and at the same time enslave others to their sin because they will take Carlos’ words and twist them. I am not perfect in this area by any means. I listen to Christian and Secular music and I love the TV shows Parks and Recreation, The Office, Dexter, and two of my favorite shows were Scrubs and The Shield. All of these shows have something in them that does not match up with Christian standards. For some reason people will tell others not to listen to secular music but then at the same time watch R rated movies??? So I write all that to say it is a confusing issue. I will draw the line at songs that are overly sexual or demean our faith in Jesus.
As for everything being art I believe we have to be careful with this in other areas as well. We could justify watching porn with this same line of thinking. We could say, “Well we are made in God’s image, and God made sex to be a beautiful thing so what is so bad about enjoying the art between two of God’s beautiful creations?” Believe me I have heard someone use this excuse before and I definitely don’t agree with that.
Xtra Large
27 OCTOBER 2011 AT 6:43 PM #
What up Los I’m new to this. Someone posted on Face Book and I read. Now I don’t agree with you on some of this blog.
First off its really hard to just listen to a beat. This seems to be the first thing a person tends to say when listening to something that he or she should not listen too. Christian or not that was my excuse before getting saved and for a time after. If it were just a beat you would not know the hooks and punch lines to songs. That’s what proved to me it was more than just a beat.
Second it really depends on you and where you are spiritually. If you can not handle it you should stay away from it. A person on a strict diet would not go put them selfs in a all u can eat buffet of grease and fat.
Music is awesome I will not deny that. But some of the music that is being played is pure garbage. From Jay and West to Katy Perry, niki minaj and the list goes on.
Your thoughts infect your mind. Your mind effects your heart. Your heart speaks out your mouth. Your words effect your atmosphere. When it comes down to it. You are what you eat.
Lyrics are living words. It’s more than just a beat.
Lastly there is plenty of us making music that is on the Jay and west level. It’s just mostly still underground. Crea and 116 is just a part of Holy Hip Hop not the only Holy hip hop.
Look forward to checking out future posts from you.
Check out some of the other Holy Hip Hop
http://Www.facebook.com/xtralargeatx
Twitter.com/xtralarge
“Make songs that are as good as Jay-Z and Kanye’s so I can listen to the heavenly lyrics you place on God’s beats. And my boy Lecrae can do it all alone.”
Sadly, I can’t take this seriously coming from a guy who’s released some of the most whitebread music I’ve ever heard. Seems you should take your own advice.
Most helpful advice I ever received on this topic was a professor in college quoting scripture.
Philippians 4:8
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.
Sure, there are a million things out there that are made with excellence. There’s way more out there to think about than there is time to think about them. We have to pick what we dwell on. Philippians 4:8 gives us a good paradigm to judge things by.
Just a thought. In the 21st century, we have the luxury of hearing the most talented musicians from around the planet. From some of the comments, it seems like one simply cannot be willing to listen to anything but the absolute best, regardless of the package it comes in. Back in the day, beautiful music was probably just the best singer in your village or maybe the weird shepherd out in the field practicing harp tabs.
This post has been on my mind like crazy! So much I felt I have to come back and TRY to express how I feel about this. I stumbled upon this blog through twitter and when I saw the title I was like “YES! I can download and get all my music back!” I love music. I owned every Jay-Z album. They’ve been deleted. over the past few days I’ve been thinking about this post and how I really can’t listen to music as I once did. I feel like we make a lot of excuses to do what MAKES US FEEL GOOD. In this situation it’s an excuse to listen to un-godly music. I have struggled with this a long time and as I’ve grown in my relationship with God it just doesn’t sit right with me anymore. Now my biggest excuse in the doggystyle days was that “it’s just the beats mom!” Later on (not long ago) I would say to myself “this is just poetry, Jay’s expressing just himself!” Don’t get me wrong, I understand we can’t block out everything and hide from the world. If I’m with some friends yeah I’ll have some fun and listen to some “good ol’ hip-hop!” But, I cant listen to it for extended periods of time. For example, I can’t listen to it while riding in my car to work because as I’m listening to what’s being said I start to feel the music. Maybe this is because of who I once was. You’re probably thinking “oh no, one of those guys with his hard knock life story and how he found the lord”. But really have seen the money. I’ve seen the girls. I’ve sold cocaine. I’ve been in so many of these places/situations that Jay (and others) talk about it makes me sick and ashamed to let it come back to my memory. Those things were not okay and I’m DEAD to them. I can listen for a while but I’ve found many times that I’m singing along I realize the things that I’m saying and all it is about how much money I got, how better I am than the next. I find it hard to believe that I’m one of the few that feel this and so many others can just block it out.
I’m pretty sure God is to be in ALL that we do. Please don’t get me wrong, I AM A SINNER. I just dont want to see people fool themselves that letting this in their hearts is okay. Each day is another day we should be seeking to learn more and be more like Jesus.
I want to note something else before I stop rambling on. It makes me think about the music out there that doesn’t talk about selling dope and all my money. What about the music that makes me feel good? The music that tells me how STRONG I am and believe in MYSELF and I can survive my trials because I AM STRONG and on and on and on..? NO I’M NOT! I have not gotten myself out of anything. Anything I have or have gotten through is not because I HAVE DONE ANYTHING. It was only because I WENT TO GOD or GOD WAS WITH ME TAKING CARE OF ME the weak child that I AM as usual.
Sorry for the rambling and my scattered thoughts this is serious. We all fall to sin and I have plenty. But if we’re not doing something to further our relationship with Him then what is it… Seek God, thank Him and talk to Him continuously througout your day and READ YOUR BIBLE.
I love y’all – PEACE…
I agree with you, but where is the line? Does this mean porn is okay if watched with an appreciation for filmmaking? Of course not. And Jay-Z or Kanye may just be somebody’s porn. Why go through all the trouble of guarding what we see, only to let our ears remain unfiltered? I think the key is to know ourselves through the lens of Christ. (Though, I still can’t see any instance where porn is permissable.)
Forget whether Kanye or Jay are Satan worshipers. Their music is just not good. I’ve never liked Kanye’s vocal tone or production. Both artists are way overrated. There is way better music than these 2 lackluster blokes.
Tryin to scoop my tix for the Dec. 16th show in Tacoma, WA baby!! I wrestled with this issue on several occasions – to the point that I once through away all my hip-hop and reggaeton cd’s (<–still regretting that one…smh) when I was in bible college – and have ultimately come to the conclusion that what I listen can affect who I am at different seasons of my life. There have been seasons where I've only listened to worship (Hillsong, Crowder, etc.) because of the condition of my soul. There have been other seasons where hip hop wasn't appropriate, but that rock was ok and vice-versa. I've learned to identify what type of season I am in spiritually, emotionally, and mentally and that helps me identify what type of music my soul needs, or can bear. As a Student Ministries Pastor I address this issue a lot with teenagers and young adults and my response is always something along the lines of what's written above.
BTW – I know what H.A.M. means, it's freakin catchy though! And the post is much appreciated.
Hello to all,
My, my! Music is one of the many forms God has that help usher in his presence. We know how important music is because he had one angel dedicated to music and every movement was a sound. Unfortunately, Satan understands how important music is also. The worldly music that we know of is simply a perverted version of the gift God has given us. You might not see anything wrong with listening to worldly music even if the language is not as bad as we think. The problem is that it does not promote spiritual grow in the kingdom of God and if that’s not happening, what is? I am a minister of music at my church. Growing up, I listened to Kurt Franklin, Jay-z, boys II Men, you know the 1985-90′s era. I love the bests instruments, all sounds, but you know what, I realized how can I follow God and teach others about him if I’m going what non-believers do? How can I witness to others on how great my life is when part of my life doesn’t involve him? God should be involve in your life in and out. Actually, he involves us completely and we involve him partly. The bottom line is God is looking for pure hearts. Its the purity of a thing. The anointing is a total package , not half, not a fourth but a total package; there’s no grey area with God. You either serve him or you don’t. I encourage those of you reading this to examine your life, understand what it means to guard your ear gates, eye gates, etc.
P.s. I no longer listen to worldly music and have done do for 12 years and counting. God gives me the songs I need to minister to his people. I can’t just listen to anything and let things in my spirit because I have lives to account for when I minister.
I’ve got a friend who strayed from the faith for years. Our family brought him back. One of the things he told us when he came to visit is that his changed life is reflected in a change in the music he listens to. He used to listen to junk. Now he’s found music he likes with godly lyrics, and it’s part of the package for him. That was then and this is now. He feels like a new man.
what strikes me is that this blog starts off with “here is what I believe” and offers no shred of Scripture to back up the argument. i don’t care what you believe…WHY do you believe it? I’m actually more prone to agree with most of what you have to say (although Jay-Z is taking it a bit far for my tastes…) but you didn’t really make a great case. Again, I leave this comment NOT because i wholeheartedly disagree but because I think as Christians trying to navigate the right way to do this life thing, if we make statements about what we “believe” without referencing the Word of God, something’s off